 John
Beaudin - Hi George thanks
for taking the time to chat. George
Winston - Thanks for all
the support I know you have been playing my music for years. George
- Yeah it was really influenced by eastern Montana where I grew
up. All the others have also but Plains especially so. I started
thinking about that album around 1989. You know my main thing
is that I work on the live shows practicing the piano and I let
records kind of manifest themselves. The main thing I do is practice
what I learned from the great New Orleans pianist like the late
James Booker, Professor Longhair and some Dr. John. George - Yes and he definitely influenced me especially on Plains. John - Phil's Out of the Frame album is a classic. George - He's the guy who captures the feel of Montana, he's the yardstick. When I first heard him I got a stack of records that had been sent and I was working so I just put one on after the other. Then when his was one I just thought 'man that feels like Montana' and the song it turned out to be his song 'Montana Half Light' John - I'm so happy that you love Phil Aaberg. George - Interestingly people think I've influenced him but truly it's the other way around he influenced me. John - How long have you known him? George - At least ten years or more. I'm always looking for tunes of his to do. I helped him put together a live album recently. It's a collection of shows he did in the eighties like 'Live from Montana' and the songs are really different from the way he did them on the record. John
- What is it about the music of Montana? I always hear honesty,
simplicity an expanse to the sound that reflects of George - Sure the sound of the wide open space. There's less things going on. It's kind of you and it. John - So do the songs create themselves, is it a smooth flow, is this easy for you? George - Well I never try to make up a tune, about once a year I do when I'm practicing so. I don't know if I can describe it as a flow there's just something that happens now and then. If it seems like a real tune, a good tune it stays if it doesn't it evaporates. The main thing is if I hear a tune I like the McLaughlin one or a Sam Cooke tune or a Beatle tune whatever I'm looking for, it becomes what I'm learning. The piano language that I practice is not the style that I made up of folk piano, that one I don't have to practice that style it's not that hard. I will be studying Henry Butler forever though that I practice. I have been studying him since 1985 and I'm just scratching the surface. John - Tell me about the dance album you've been thinking about? George - Well you may hear Love Potion # 9 and some good Rhythm and Blues. I'll tell you more later. John - I hear you don't listen to radio. George - I virtually know nothing about contemporary music. I just don't have time. I just rely on people to tell me about tunes. I check out tunes that people suggest. My era is basically 1957 to 67. I find that's where I find most of my tunes. John - As a teen what did you play? George - I didn't play. I only started after High School. In high school I listened to a lot of stuff and I don't have those stories of having to learn to play as a kid. Having to play when you don't want to that just kills me, your not going to get anything out of that.
George - Sure but there's no self discipline involved in doing what someone else wants under a threat. There's nothing positive that comes out of that for anyone but if you say to yourself yeah I've got to get this done but the minute the disciplinary leaves what are you going to do? Slack off- it's a natural thing. John - Do you still hate the term New Age music? George - I think New Age is just meditation stuff I have nothing to do with that, they called me Jazz and classical before the New Age tag came along. I can tell people about my tag, its rural folk piano. John - I have a few friends who love Bill Evan who also love your music. George - I like Bill a lot but he was an inspiration not an influence. I'm not a Jazz player at all. I love the Jazz tradition but I'm very much a rhythm and blues player. When I did the tribute to Vince Guaraldi, the Linus and Lucy album when he took a Jazz solo I took an R&B solo. John - That was a successful album how long did it take for you to put it together? George - The idea came about in 1976. That one grew real slow. There will be another one of those because I do sixty of his songs so there will be another. For most artists I'll do maybe one or two songs for instance the Beatles it's five, Gershwin two but Vince Guaraldi it's sixty. Sometimes I'll be motivated to look at everything a composer's done sometimes I won't. I do try as much as I can to look into everything, there's a joy in looking into everything. John - Does that include looking at his personal history for instance with Vince Guaraldi? George - I do that a little bit but to me the music tells a deeper story and honestly you never know what's true. If someone tells a story you never know if it's true sure it's interesting but that's all it is. One of the composers that I do the most songs of on guitar is Queen Lili`uokalani Hawaii's last monarch and I do about fourteen of hers and the I never get to the books she wrote, if I had a lot of time maybe I would. I'm all that motivated that way. Primary to me is the sound that's all there is. If I'm reading a story well it's just because the sound is what got me interested in this person in the first place. John - Do you still tour about one hundred days a year? George - Oh I'm always touring. It doesn't have to be around a new album I just get out there a lot. John
- With the Windham Hill label of the eighties there was a sense
of trust that the company had you could buy on label George - I liked the early first records from the label that were solo instrumental and by the way I picked my own covers everyone thought because they all looked alike they were done by the label but I picked my own covers. I approve everything sure I take advice but the final say is me and why not you're the one that's a jerk if it's a bad record. John - Has the label changed a lot for you since they were bought by BMG? George - I haven't really followed it since the early days really, maybe the first thirteen records. I can't really tell. I keep in touch with artist's not labels and really all the records I have I can't even tell you what labels they are on can you? John - Well I can for a lot of them but that's my job to know that. Tell me about Floyd Cramer, when did your love for his music start? George - I started to listen to him about 1960 and just got every record I could. I had the Tijuana Brass and Booker T and MG's. I do four of Floyd's songs. John - Do you do Last Date? George - Oh yeah that one and On the Rebound, The First Hurt and Hot Pepper. John - Do you still talk to Will Ackerman? George - No between interviews and doing the work I unfortunately don't have time to talk to anyone much. I write a letter occasionally.
George
- I don't really but my label does, Dancing Cat does. Don't get
me wrong it's definitely a great thing. If we can get the Sunday
paper that way were all going to be better off. George - Well I definitely had water and remember I live in California so an earthquake is always on people's minds. Its part of life and it's good to have a few extra things and you can give them to someone who doesn't. It's much better to give than to have to find. John - And I know you do food drives at all your shows. George - Yeah we have been doing that since 1986. We just ask people to bring cans of food and it goes to the local food bank. John - Is that PBS video still available? George - It should be. The deal I have is everything stays in print forever or I have control to distribute it myself. So if someone wants that it will always be around. John - The Hawaiian Slack Key Guitar has been a huge inspiration to you. George - It's like Phil Aaberg in some ways it reminds me of Montana, the old traditions you know. You have to find what reminds you of your region and that does even though the Hawaii is thousands of miles from Montana. The slack reminds me of Montana in the spring more than anything else. I felt that the second I hear it. You know we all have songs that we grow on and we have songs that change your life right now. John - I remember you saying before that with the slack key it filled a huge gap in your musical life. George
- Well before the slack key there was 99.9 percent missing but
I would never have dreamed that it would be Hawaiian, most Hawaiian
music was just too commercial. In the world music bin I would
go from Haiti to Israel I wouldn't even look in John - Well then how did you discover it? George - Quite by accident I came upon Gaby Pahanui and Eddie Kamae and I was just hooked. In 1985 we finally started recording and what I wanted was I wanted to hear these players alone I really wanted to hear the instrument. Good things take time it took me twenty four years to find the slack key, it took me eleven years to record it but it took me a second to recognize it. John - Ever get frustrated with the lack of airplay on radio other than University, NPR or specialty programming? George - You know radio is not part of my reality. You know when I'm in the car I'm working on the next slack key record not listening to radio. It wouldn't occur to me to turn on the radio. Once in a while I'll check out an oldies station and I'll hear something that I might want to do. For instance I don't even know what Hip-hop is and I can't tell you the title of a single Michael Jackson song or a single Springsteen tune. I've heard Bruce Hornsby quiet a bit and checked out all the other Sarah McLachlan tunes to see if there was anything that would work for me. John - What do you think of Bruce Hornsby? George - Oh I love him! I remember someone sent me a demo that he made for Windham Hill in 1985. I have never met him but I have everything he's done. I've worked on three of his songs especially The Way it Is, Mandolin Rain and Every Little Kiss to work but I couldn't quiet make them work as piano solos-close but not quiet. You kind of need that great story he's telling. He's such a great player John - I've talked to him twice, he's a good guy. George - You know I listen to Hornsby in Montana like I listen to Phil (Aaberg) especially that first album it really captures that very different rural way of writing. I don't know how to tag what he does that's his job. I think everyone should find a very brief description of what they do and label themselves because you can't expect everyone to know who you are. Each musician really is there own category but if someone asks you what do you do? You can't sit there and explain it for an hour- that's ridiculous. Bruce Hornsby has such a great mixture of Folk, Blues, Jazz and a little bit of New Orleans and a lot of McCoy Tyner. I love the live album he put out, the solo's are great and I love that intro he did on Harbor Lights. John - It gave me goose bumps when I first heard it.
John - Hornsby is also re-writing the book on his next album, he doesn't like to stay in the same place. George - I'm not surprised that I will be surprised. There's always something to learn like sometimes the bass player will play the third on the bass instead of the root and it just has that thick sound of suspension and you know. I'm a real root player and I think 'oh yeah that's right remember to play other notes other than the note of the Chord and the bass.' John - That suspension I love. George
- Yeah it makes it want to go someplace. It's hanging so it takes
you as a listener. There are chords called suspended chords and
that's what they do they really want to go someplace else and
that's why I think they're so effective. They're not stable and
that's dramatic I think in our lives we're drawn to the unstable
drama which we pay dearly for sometimes but it's exciting. Those
chords are like that. It's funny it's like is that because I grew
up thinking that's what it is or is that a real physical principle?
You know it doesn't matter it's what do you like? What do you
as a listener like? That's the only thing that really matters
because no matter what anybody tells you you should like well
the listener is always correct. If someone doesn't like what I
do I could either have played it better or I'm not their taste
but the listener is absolutely always correct. I don't care if
it's Bach or Rap it's what they like. I wasn't incorrect that
I like the Tijuana Brass better than the Beatles as a kid- I was
totally John - Too me that would be too constricting. George - But it's amazing in a way but I don't think I would be capable of that. It there's something that you can't do wouldn't be what you would do anyway then maybe you can live with it (laugh). John - So needless to say you've never done the orchestra thing? George - Oh no I look at everything as instrumental solo. I always refer people to Phil Aaberg. I guess I could but it's not really who I am. John - In the eighties were you surprised when you became one of the poster artists for acoustic instrumental music? George - Oh yeah I wasn't expecting it. I was just doing my thing. I had done a record for John Faheys label back in 1972 and it was like that old saying that I think Chet Atkins came up with "That record sold like hot cakes, a dollar a stack"(laugh) So yeah by the time I hooked up with Will on Windham Hill and It took off I was very surprised. John - In the eighties people would always mention you along with Andreas Volleweider and Enya. It was a new age gang. George - I don't really know Enya's stuff or any of those acts but I love Andreas Vollenweider, I don't care about who's in New Age or Isn't I just know I'm not. John - I love Vollenweider's Down to the Moon. George - I love the second side of Down to the Moon. That whole thing is just one giant great song. He's definitely has a unique thing. I admire him and he's his own bass player on the Harp, he's a great improviser and there's so much feeling in what he does.
George - Three or four times. I don't get a chance to see a lot of people live. There's so much to learn from him and be inspired. John - What tunes are you working on? George - Well I'm always working on another Henry Butler technique. The other day I learnt Honey Pie and Lady Madonna by the Beatles and before then I learnt Body and Soul from the thirties. That's what I like I say 'man that's a great tune and I want to play that.' Then you have to figure out a way to do it and none of these songs are solo instrumentals really very few are ever. It's a matter of having to make it work and not all tunes do. I wish I could have made the Bruce Hornsby work because any tune I like I try to learn. Sometime it takes a long time to make it work it took ten years to learn the theme to Alfred Hitchcock. John - Do you relax or are you always working? George - Always working I've always just worked until I dropped. If it should be done and or I want to do it and hopefully it's both then why not. I saw a check list for work a holics and listen I had them all the only thing is that I like it all. I'll retire when I leave the body. I'm not looking to get anything I'm just looking to do. So yeah I had all fifty on the checklist and if I hadn't I would have certainly incorporated the ones I didn't (laugh). John - Are you the type of artist that ever wonders where the music comes from? George - Well I don't know. It might be different for everybody. I don't ever intend to compose a tune but I find that once a year I make one up so I don't really know and I'll go 'hey that's pretty good' Sometime I'll wonder in my dreams did I go to a museum and listen to records on another existence or plane and then I bring it back and then I get to copyright it. It's a mystery to me it could be that things turn around like in your computer when you press something it take a while to do it maybe that's what happens when we write first the intention is there so the master computer then thinks for a while and then the song just comes out in time. We are not conscious of that of course of any of this kind of like we are not conscious of our heart beating and maybe we shouldn't since both are an automatic thing. Bach did a lot of his stuff on commission; I don't know how he did it. I couldn't come up with anything that someone else wanted and to do it on the spot. John -
What gets you hooked as a listener to music? John - That's interesting you look for different versions. George - As many as I can. Like with that Hitchcock theme I listened to eight different versions. I listened to them and then I thought ok who am I in all this. It turned out to be a way which was not the way the song was composed. Remember I'm asking myself how can I make this work if no one has ever heard the Alfred Hitchcock show. Hopefully they would "oh nice piano solo." Think of Love Potion #9 how does that work as a piano solo? It needs to not depend on the fact that someone's heard the original version. It needs to work as is. John - With that in mind tell me how you tackled Vince Gauraldi's Linus and Lucy for instance? George - That's an interesting example. When I first heard that I wasn't a player but back then I was thinking 'man I got to go buy that tune' now I'm saying 'I got to play that tune.' Back then when I liked the tune I got it, I bought it, now I play it. To me it's just the same thing because back then was just playing it on a record player now wanting it means playing it as a piano solo. You see it's still me wanting to do what I want to do with the tune. The record buyer and I the artist are both doing what we want to do with my songs. John - Gauraldi died in the mid seventies right? George - Yeah he passed on in 1976. He did the first sixteen Peanuts animations. John - And didn't they fit well. George - To me it was just a perfect match with Charles Schulz and Vince Guarladi. I talked to Charles about that years ago and said it's just like Lennon and McCartney enhancing each other a lot. Another one is Stanley Kubrick and Gyorgy Ligeti who did the music for 2001 A Space Odyssey. That was a perfect match. John - How would you liked to be remembered? George - Actually I would like to not be. I would like people to go on and think about who is here even I'm a victim of that too sometimes I remember who isn't here. So I would say I would rather not be. John - Thanks so much for talking with me. George - It has been a pleasure.
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course
the view of the land.
John
- Yeah if it's your own self discipline of getting something done
well that's fine.
George
- It's a great intro, he's so good at that. The intro to Every
Little Kiss is incredible and the next time you talk to him tell
him I love him. You know I'm just a student of the piano. Oscar
Peterson has said the piano is a never ending exploration and
I also love Bill Evans and Bruce loved him also With Bruce I love
the way he uses fourths and he just does things on the piano that
makes me say 'well I wouldn't of thought of that.'
correct.
I wasn't a Beatles fan until the eighties. I'd rather play Buddy
Holly than Chopin because that's just who I am. There are so many
great Chopin players so that would definitely not be what I would
be good at, exactness is not my forte its better if I got a little
leeway in the song (laugh). |
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