John
Beaudin
- Congrats on the National Jazz Award for vocalist!
Carol
Welsman - Thanks John. I am thrilled!
John
- Were you surprised when you won?
Carol
-Yes, it was a real surprise to receive this award, especially because it's a
public vote. There are so many good singers here in Canada., so I am honored.
John
- Award shows are always a great place to network and meet old friends did you
attend?
Carol
- Ya, I arrived in from my Niagara Symphony performance in the nick of time. The
Awards night itself was fantastic- really professional and extremely well organized.
I also had a chance to re-connect with many musicians and industry people.
John - I
have to tell you this funny story. Last year I was going through this stage of
not listening to any Smooth Jazz as a result of the CRTC's decision of not granting
a license here in Vancouver. I guess I was feeling sorry for myself but thought
I'd made this conscious decision to abandon this format forever. I found that
every time I'd get up to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night I'd have
this song in my head. Then it would be in my head when I got up in the morning,
and in the shower and the words kinda sounded like this (singing) "I believe
in sunsets drifting into night I believe in angels dancing in the light".
Carol
- (laughing) Hey, that sounds familiar!
John
- I thought it would. So it started haunting
me, I'd be racking
my brain thinking who sings this song? Then it came to
me it was 'I Believe' from your Latest 'Hold Me'. So Carol thanks for the inspiration!
Carol
- Aren't you nice, you're more than welcome.
John
- With your song going through my head I kinda felt like Al Pacino in Godfather
3 when he said "Just when I thought I was out they pulled me back in."
I can't seem to shake this format. So you just got back from L.A.?
Carol
- I'm on L.A. time still so I just had a big bite of lunch so my blood
sugar wouldn't drop on you suddenly.
John
- (laughing) Yeah, I'd be thinking that Carol Welsman, she's a bring down.
Carol
- (Laughing) She just fell asleep during that interview. When I travel like this
I sometimes have problems sleeping. Last night I was up until 3am.
John
- Are you a night owl?
Carol
- I am, well you know what happens I go to L.A. and I try to get
a ka-zillion
things done in six days. So, I'll meet with my musician friends late at night
we'll go for a late dinner and I get back to the house around 1:30 am - 2:00 am.
So yes, I stay up until 1:00 am at least every night. Out there in L.A. I stay
up even later but the problem is it's so hard adjusting when I come back to Toronto.
John - Well as
you can imagine doing this genre of music I've been stuck doing evenings on air
since no one until the Hamilton Smooth Jazz outlet was willing to play this stuff
in the day time. So you're preaching to the converted, I know about being a night
owl. I'm hoping to talk with the people running the The Wave in Hamilton in a
few weeks. Have you actually heard the station?
Carol
- Oh yeah! I know Doug Kirk really well. I actually went up to Ottawa to sit
on the panel. (the CRTC panel applying for the format)
John
- You were also here in Vancouver correct? (at the CRTC hearing that had six Smooth
Jazz applicants)
Carol
- Yes I was and actually I'm being filmed tonight at six o'clock for the people
who are applying in Winnipeg, that's Global. They were going to fly me out, they
phoned me and asked me to come out but it turns out I have a performance in Denver
that day so they said a video would be great. So I'm really involved. Doug has
really done numbers. He has a friend in Columbus Ohio, Bill Harman, who also has
a station and they've been playing 'Hold Me' down there. It's been the most requested
song on there for the last two weeks since they put it on except the CD isn't
even out in the states!
John
- Can't they order it online?
Carol
- Yes on hmv.com.
John
- How surprised were you with the CRTC's decision
here in Vancouver not to grant any of the six applicants a Smooth Jazz License?
Carol
- It was really quite disheartening especially with the fact that when
my album, "Hold Me" came out last year and I was thinking the timing
was neat that the albums were actually going to get some airplay. It seemed with
everyone applying that we were really going to start filling in with that format
in each city. I actually wasn't aware of how many applications there were for
smooth jazz in Vancouver until you told me.
John
- It was overwhelming.
Carol
- It was. I was really disappointed. It just made me think of how
straight
laced and conservative the CRTC is. It's a format of music that provides us with
a ton of different musicians that otherwise we would never hear other than on
your show in Vancouver. How far does your show go? You're in Vancouver, what about
the rest of the country?
John
- I learned there was easily enough to keep the
format going. Well the good news is that Hamilton's up and running and Calgary
will be by the summer of 2002.
Carol
- As for Winnipeg I don't know what kind of chance they have, it could
go either way you just never know.
John
- After the Vancouver situation who knows. My first thought was how could the
CRTC ignore such an overwhelming amount of applicants for the Smooth Jazz format?
All six applicants out of eleven overall applicants. Each of the six did their
marker surveys, each searched out the musicians in the market as well as in the
province then overall in Canada. Each applicant came to the conclusion that this
was the best format for the city and that's of course independent of each other.
Plus, we've been doing this format at QM-FM in the evening for ten years. It works!
Hell, I thought it would help CHUM's bid since we have been committed to the genre
for ten years. A genre that no one else in the market touched and stayed with.
Now remember Smooth Jazz is a special CRTC category, in other words we never had
to play this stuff. We played it because we wanted to, we sincerely had a love
for the genre. Of course the show's been cancelled now so no one is playing it
here.
Carol
- I don't really understand their decision.
John
- Once I took myself out of the equation and my hopes in getting this genre here
in Vancouver I did have to admit that the Urban CHR format that they did award
would be a higher ranking station than Smooth Jazz. So, if that's what their criteria
was then I get it but it still wouldn't really change the sound of Vancouver the
way a Smooth Jazz station would of. I think a lot of the musicians on this Urban
station are getting played on different stations in the market now, that wasn't
the case with the Jazz musicians.
Carol
- I'm quite unaware of all the particulars that you're mentioning now and really
didn't know what made this whole thing tick, and now that you explain it, it does
make sense. I just figured that Smooth Jazz had been around alot longer in the
U.S. and I figured that by now Canada would catch up especially with the way communications
are with the internet. People have much quicker way to catch on quicker. You know
there were more Smooth Jazz stations in the States. Now there are only about 34
which is small.
John
- In the 80's it was actually the second fastest growing format after golden oldies.
Interestingly it evolved for us at CKXM-FM in Edmonton much like it did for Frank
Cody's people at the Wave in L.A. from a format almost exclusively New Age to
almost exclusively Smooth Jazz.
Carol
- I just hope as a format it can survive. I just know there's a lot of
great music categorized as Smooth Jazz out there.
John
- Ain't that the truth. Let's talk about your album "Hold Me". I know
it's cliché to say she makes the old songs her own but when I heard you
sing 'Night and Day' or 'Why' or Billy Joel's "And So It Goes", you
really add a different slant to it because your songs are fresh.
Carol
- To me it's a compliment to hear that, thank you. If I put my own signature
on something that's the whole reason why I'm doing it. Why would you just be a
cover artist of a bunch of songs and do them the way everyone else has. Actually,
there was one song that I really wanted on that album and will probably record
it on the next one. It's a Sting song. I do it as a ballad, "It's Every Breath
You Take". You know I really wanted to do it but Puff Daddy did it and my
producer down there said it's been done to death. My whole shtick is putting in
chords that the composer didn't think of and I hope they're tasteful. That's the
whole point.
John
- I love your inflect on Joel's 'And so it Goes'.
Carol
- That one in particular Ronnie (Foster her producer) really heard it. When I
played it slower with no tempo and I thought, wow, that's going to be difficult
but it was a great idea because it took it far away from what Billy Joel had done.
Then I thought, lets change key so again the whole idea is if you're going to
do something add some jazz harmony to it. I always wanted to make it a little
more of a sophisticated version because that's the style that I do. I'm glad you
like that, it's great.
John
- This is more than the old 'lets kiss the artists
butt thing' but I think 'Hold Me' is one of the best Smooth Jazz CD's of the last
5-10 years and remember unconsciously I was going to the bathroom to your melodies
so I guess I've been brainwashed by the magical Carol Welsman Voo-doo thing.
Carol
- (laughing) We need you to come on board to our promotional team. John, it's
so nice to hear. You know one of the problems that I face and maybe it's a good
thing is that "Hold Me" hasn't come out in the states. The Smooth Jazz
format in Hamilton has put on "Little Caesar" on the air and they have
not stuck like glue to the Broadcast architecture (U.S. Smooth Jazz Consulting
Firm) law in the states. You see in the states we thought there were tracks that
were Smooth Jazzable. Apparently, after talking to another producer in the states
the thought was that we needed to beef up some of the rhythm tracks in order for
it to match on Smooth Jazz Radio down there. But the reality is in the US it's
so tight the only vocalists they play are Sade, Al Jarreau, George Benson, Michael
Mcdonald or Mariah Carey. These are all famous people and usually they are old
songs. On the Wave 94.7 in L.A. they were playing yesterday (Singing) "I
keep forgettin I'm not in love anymore" Now how old is that, twenty five
years old?
John
- I was listening to KKSF in San Francisco yesterday online and they also played
it.
Carol
- They're all in cahoots with each other. I had lunch the other day with Guy
Eckstine, Billy Eckstine's son and Guy produced Incognito. He did Herbie Hancock's
Jazz Standard CD. He's a lovely Guy, very musical and I'd love to work with him.
He said the same thing that it's really hard to break in from the artist's stand
point. So I'm glad as a programmer you like the album. Of course were going to
move on from that and I should be signing a new deal within the next month in
Los Angeles, and we'll start anew again.
John
- So your grandfather started the Toronto Symphony that must have been a tough
gig he was a real crusader.
Carol
- I was just telling someone last night that I have a box of programs from
the symphony from 1906 to 1914 and from 1909, I have the program that has Rachmaninoff
as guest artist playing the 'concerto in C minor'. I guess he was the biggest
name that came and I just thought wow, my grandfather was a lucky guy. He was
really a hard worker and he ended up funding the symphony out of his pocket for
the last couple of years and they disbanded during the war because they ran out
of money. Isn't that the same old thing with symphonies? It's really cool we all
have a picture of him conducting in Massey Hall and in fact on my swing album.
John
- You dedicated that album to him right?
Carol
- Yes and the Swing album has his picture on the front. He's sort of burnt into
the background.
John
- Years ago when Frank Mills released his Transitions album which was a little
Smooth Jazz but mostly New Age he co-hosted a show with me and he told me that
his greatest moment was playing on stage with a symphony.
Carol
- Oh yeah absolutely! We're doing the Niagara Symphony next month and
I can't wait because it may be the only symphony concert this spring. It's such
a great moment to be surrounded by people who are playing acoustically. It really
is something and I have a lot of fun with my guys. What he said is true.
John
- I think it was 1988 or 1989 when Frank Mills
came by. He was so enthused by the whole thing I went home and listened to some
baroque and I have to tell you I wasn't a big classical fan but that little chat
opened a door for me.
Carol
- Where it really hits me is when you go to a movie and there's a
beautiful
score like a John Williams score and you hear it over the big speakers. That's
where it hits me again. You hear all the strings and it's so rich and there's
nothing that can replace it, but the arrangements have to be really good.
John
- Your albums not Can-con is it?
Carol
- The song 'Hold Me' is can-con, its music, lyric and artist so it fits into the
maple thing.
John
- Interestingly can-con has been around so long
that some programmers hate it and alot mostly because they have to do it. Tell
anyone they have to do something and they'll wince but in any format there is
certainly enough can-con. What are your thoughts on can-con?
Carol
- It doesn't really bother me. As a Jazz artist it doesn't seem to make a
huge difference because there isn't a lot of my music that is Canadian content.
Since we don't get a lot of airplay it doesn't really make any difference. If
I were a pop artist, can-con would be more of an issue because you know that you
could get played more I guess. The good thing about the song 'Hold Me' which is
can-con, is we made a video of it. It gets onto Bravo and they support it.
John
- By the way your internet site looks great
and what's the deal with you and the president? (Bill Clinton)
Carol
- (laughing) Nothing at all darling.
John
- In the picture on your site you look taller than he is you seem to tower over
that guy
Carol
- (laughing) No, I guess we're around the same height. A friend of mine sent me
a version of it framed. I was singing for a fundraiser this summer and he was
the key note speaker. It was for the sick children's hospital here and I gave
him a CD after the performance. He said "I heard the first song you played"
(singing) 'Beyond the sea' and he started singing it to me. He actually worked
it into his speech. He said "With all the millions of things going on in
our world today, for example even tonight, here we have all these people, a great
meal and everything else. Now how many people retained what songs the performer's
played? " That's what he said.
John
- That's cool
Carol
- And he said "On average if you retain three of them through the
whole evening you're doing really well". So he actually made a reference
to us, that was really nice.
John
- Well my friends and I have talked a lot about Bill Clintonism and that's the
magnetic connection he has with whoever he talks to. In other words when he's
talking with you he is there a 110%, you have him there undivided.
Carol
- Oh yes that's so true, I was actually shaking. I handed him the CD and said
"I'd like you to have this CD as a memento of this evening" and he didn't
say anything. He was looking down at the picture on the album cover then he said
"wow, that is a beautiful picture of you" (laughing) but there was this
uncomfortable five second period, I was thinking, is this guy going to haul off
and hit me for stopping him? I had no idea what he was going to do.
John
- (laughing) man that's nerve racking!!
Carol
- and everyone has asked the royal question did he hit on ya?
John
- He'll never shake that I guess.
Carol
- Another highlight was I got to sing for Gordon Lightfoot. I actually did
an arrangement of his song "Beautiful"' at the Toronto Arts Awards.
I slowed it way down and added a bunch of Jazz chords and he thought it was good.
John
- I have a lot of respect for Gordon Lightfoot.
Years ago when I was syndicating this rock show called 'The Cross Canada Report'
one of the guys on my team interviewed Lightfoot and at the end he nervously asked
him to do an ID for the show and he just calmly said "I don't do Id's".
It may sound like a little thing but I know alot of artists do them when they
really don't want to, so good for him.
Carol
- He's a good guy.
John
- Tell me about your influences.
Carol
- Steely Dan, George Benson, Stevie Wonder, the latter of whom I met on Saturday
night?
John
- Really?
Carol
- He was at the NAMM Show. He came and played the piano. They Only brought
him in once, the crowds were gone. I heard the rumor and stuckaround. Ronnie Foster,
my producer, used to play with Stevie. He toured with him and knows him really
well so he introduced me to him, it was great. Oh yes, my influences, there's
also Al Jarreau, Tania Maria who's Brazilian. She scats and plays the piano simultaneously
and that's something that I love doing. I'm not a big soloist on the piano it's
not my big thing, but I love doing that. I also like Billy Joel and Sting, mostly
male singers. I don't care for female vocalists that much. I liked Phoebe Snow,
unusual people. There's also Joni Mitchell. In certain senses my favorite singer
is Shirley Horn who really has no range, but she's amazing.
John
- I love Shirley Horn, now there's a distinctive voice.
Carol
- She has so much soul which proves the fact that you really don't have to have
a lot of range. Ella Fitzgerald was also a huge influence in the beginning. I
knew when I was twenty years old when I was finishing up at Berklee, I was already
doing arrangements and they were very pop slanted. It was definitely in the Stevie
Wonder, George Benson vein, not swing music. I like a lot of Brazilian too Like
Sergio Mendes.
John
- The Brazilian thing has been very big in Smooth Jazz interestingly it influenced
different genre's of Jazz, it adds a certain freshness to Smooth Jazz. There have
been a lot of tribute albums. I like the one Honoring Ivan Lins. I love him a
lot and then there's of course the godfather Antonio Carlos Jobim.
Carol
- Oh yeah and Lee Ritenour did the Twist Of Jobim.
John
- When did you discover that you had a voice?
Carol
- Well I was apparently singing in tune before I could talk.
John
- Wow, there's something that should go on a card, that's pretty cool.
Carol
- When I was really young I climbed up onto this highchair. I was singing
"oh my darling, oh my darling Clementine" but I didn't know the words.
John
- When did the piano come?
Carol
- I started fooling around when I was three playing by ear what my brothers were
studying, but I started really when I was five.
John
- So this whole music machine it's like walking
to you. You don't know anything else, it's who you are.
Carol
- I know (laughing)
John
- Well the world is full of sob stories of people saying who am I, what do I do
with myself, that's a lifelong gig for a lot of people.
Carol
- Well that's true. I've had one straight job in my life. I was a cashier
for two summers in a grocery store and saved up money to go skiing and do fun
stuff. I've interpreted in court trials. I speak French and Italian and I'll still
do interpreting jobs. If they have major trials I'll do a trial just to keep up
my languages. Now I'm actually studying Spanish. Languages are my thing so I've
only really had freelance jobs that either have to do with languages or music.
So you're right, I'm lucky in that way. Part of it is because my three brothers
are all musical too. We all play, we all have the same ear. We all had different
styles of music, one was into rock. Like Jimi Hendrix was playing all day long.
Then another one got into Bob Marley and another one was into country and my dad
had Count Basie records. There were always two piano's playing in the house and
usually a guy on the drums. So we had a lot of music around the house at a very
young age and both of my parents play. So we have jam sessions at Thanksgiving.
We go to the cottage and the neighbors come over and we have this big jam. We
do songs like 'Change the World' and we all do harmonies, everybody grabs a guitar
or maracas. So there really wasn't a lot of deciding to do with this or that...
it was music hands down. I actually changed high schools because I was playing
violin in the orchestra and I went to a school that had tons of music.
John
- So you grew up in Toronto?
Carol
- Yes
John
- Well the studies show it and either dateline NBC or 20/20 had a great feature
on it. They showed a mother daughter team each starting to play the violin at
the same time. I think the daughter was eight years old or younger and for like
a week they were at the same stage but the daughter quickly left her mother in
the dust in the learning process her mind was like a sponge. The studies have
shown exposing a kid to music at that age also helps in a lot of different forms
of academia.
Carol
- Well you know we've been so blessed with great music. When I was talking
to Guy Eckstine the other day and he mentioned how great it was when Steely Dan
won the Grammy. For the first time in my life I actually let out a scream. I was
so excited. I'm not really like that. Really, I was so happy.
John
- Isn't "Two Against Nature" a great album? Did you see the Ken Burns
special on jazz?
Carol
- No I didn't.
John
- Well it's out there on DVD I recommend it. The box set is reviewed on SmoothJazzCanada.com.
I thought they skipped a few era's of jazz but it did help sales. The whole special
brought up a reality of the industry for me. When I was writing the review I really
thought about how the charts are held hostage by the likes of teen queens like
Britney Spears, who really don't have the vocal range to sing live and boy bands
who really all sound the same. Jazz sales are five percent of the market and that's
all genres of jazz and some sub types of instrumental.
Carol
- Oh yeah.
John
- Are you concerned about the CDR generation? There could be someone out there
burning twenty copies of your album and giving it out for Christmas.
Carol
- Well, I'm not so sure it happens. Does it alot?
John
- I think so. I don't know about your albums but in general sure. Do you know
Brian Hughes?
Carol
- Yes
John
- I was talking to him a couple of days ago and he said sure it concerns him.
Some guy came up to him after a show and said "I love your stuff I have a
CDR copy of all your CD's". Now how could someone not be able to connect
the dots enough to realize that he just told Brian Hughes, I just robbed you.
Carol
- Well especially with the internet now it concerns me. Just eight years ago
I went to a Canadian music week thing just before I started to record. They were
talking on the panel that eventually the music business was going to go in this
direction that retail might die out. It would be pay as you choose on the internet,
you'd buy the songs you want. The main concern is that there are all these sites
where you can download this stuff for free though. Here's the thing though. It
isn't CD quality and I don't know how many people care about that. The funny thing
is most of my friends who have the most incredible sound systems are not musicians.
I have a very primitive sound system here I have only what I need to make my sequencing
sound good so I don't have surround sound or speakers upstairs.
John
- Hey, I love that David Foster quote about you
reminding him of what he could have been like if he worked on his craft.
Carol
- Yeah, I remind him of what he would have become had he worked on his craft.
It's unbelievable I think he's really good at doing those quotes. It's a nice
quote.
John
- Hey, that's a pretty great quote.
Carol
- It is a nice thought. I sometimes wonder about those things. I've never
minded them for me. That is a very nice quote, but sometimes when I read other
people's press kits and I see quotes from really big people I often don't believe
them. So I think why do I have them up there? Why do I need these people to justify
it, you know?
John
- I hear you, but I think they help when I heard Elton John was a big Moby fan,
I wanted to hear Moby. When Elton was throwing out quotes for Ryan Adams one of
his inspirations for his new 'Songs from the Westside' CD, I wanted to hear Ryan
Adams.
Carol
- Well you know what else, I now have four CD's out and I'm reasonably
well known with three Juno nominations and a fairly extensive performing career.
The quotes are merely compliments from musicians who happen to be great friends
and supportive ones at that. I'm honored that they would say such lovely things.
John
- Exactly, you know if I accidentally went into
your site without knowing who you were quotes like those would make me real curious
about who you are. I read reviews, I'd be a hypocrite not to considering I've
been a music critic for more years than I can remember. Interestingly what you
just said about quotes has been like a mantra almost from alot of the artist's
that I've talked to through the years. So, I think we're all a little squeamish
to taut our own horn, but hell, why not? I think it's a necessary part of the
business. Carol, it's truly been a pleasure to finally chat. Thank you so much.
Carol
- John, thank you as well. It was fun and good luck on the site
